Two mass shootings have rocked the United States in less than 24 hours, leaving dozens dead and many more wounded. The first in El Paso, Texas was allegedly perpetrated by a white supremacist whose racist motives are outlined in a rambling “manifesto”, the second allegedly by a self-described “leftist” whose motives, like the 2017 Las Vegas shooter, are presently unknown. These incidents occurred a week after another mass shooting in Gilroy, California.
All the usual US gun control debates have of course reignited, which is understandable. Alongside this debate, however, we are seeing another, far more pernicious agenda being raised that I would like to address here.
Malcolm discusses the need for congress to pass domestic terrorism laws. @MalcolmNance #AMJoy pic.twitter.com/PWlH85IYF6
— La Femme Nikita, PhD (@LaF3mm3Nikita) August 4, 2019
In an interview with MSNBC’s Joy Reid, notorious liar and propagandist Malcolm Nance claimed that existing laws aren’t sufficient for prosecuting the El Paso shooter, because there are no laws designating his act of mass murder as “domestic terrorism”.
“I think that Congress needs to take up right away a series of domestic terrorism laws,” Nance said. “It’d be very simple: just match them to the words ‘international terrorism’, so that a member of al-Qaeda and a member of a white nationalist terrorist cell or a militia that thinks they’re going to carry out international acts of terrorism are equal all the way around. Right now there are no laws called ‘domestic terrorism law’. They can get you for firearms, they get you for hate crimes, but you are not treated as a terrorist. This act in El Paso was clearly by all definitions a terrorist attack in the United States, but of course by the nature of the person being white and American he can’t be treated like a member of ISIS or al-Qaeda. He can’t even be detained, he can only be treated as a murderer.”
(The accused, for the record, is in fact under arrest currently, and prosecutors say that they are treating it as a domestic terrorism case for which they are seeking the death penalty. This is in Texas; he’ll be dead before the next Fast & Furious movie. Nance’s notion that prosecutors’ hands are somehow tied here is silly.)
“But he’s a murderer with a political intent who is spreading an ideology,” Nance continued. “So Congress should take that up immediately. And let’s see if the White House won’t sign that legislation. That would be very revealing.”
In other words, shove the legislation through and call anyone who opposes it a Nazi lover.
Years of misguided alarmism over "Islamic terrorism" resulted in the erosion of civil liberties, militarization of police, and a host of other bad outcomes. Applying the same alarmist logic to "white nationalist terrorism" is likely to produce a host of similarly bad outcomes
— Michael Tracey (@mtracey) August 4, 2019
Political commentary is flooded with the word “terrorism” today. People are demanding that the El Paso shooter in particular and white supremacists in general be labeled terrorists by the narrative-making commentariat, and you know what? I totally get it. The push since 9/11 to tar Muslims as “terrorists” has been extremely obnoxious and fueled by hate and bigotry, so it makes sense for progressive-minded people to push for the egalitarian usage of that term. But before doing so, please reflect on what lessons we learned from the post-9/11 “Islamic terrorism” scare.
“Years of misguided alarmism over ‘Islamic terrorism’ resulted in the erosion of civil liberties, militarization of police, and a host of other bad outcomes. Applying the same alarmist logic to ‘white nationalist terrorism’ is likely to produce a host of similarly bad outcomes,” tweeted independent journalist Michael Tracey in response to the chatter.
“I am telling you now that the government will use the violence that Trump himself has rallied as an excuse for more militarization, more surveillance, more violations of civil liberties — and a lot of people are going to welcome these things because they are afraid,” tweeted Truthout‘s Kelly Hayes. “I’m not guessing or being creative here. This is about having a sense of history and a sense of how these systems function in the present. I would love to be wrong. I would celebrate being wrong. But I’m not.”
Indeed, it is an established fact that the US government will use the narrative about the need to fight terrorism to advance pre-existing agendas. The first draft of the massive USA Patriot Act was introduced a week after the 9/11 attacks, far too fast for anyone to have gathered the necessary information from all the relevant government bodies about what changes were necessary and typed out the hundreds of pages of the bill. Legislators later admitted that they didn’t even have time to read through the densely worded bill before passing it the next month, so to believe that it could have been written in a week would be childish.
High-altitude surveillance balloons have been deployed over America to "deter narcotic trafficking and homeland security threats” via "hi-tech radar". To be clear, this is not something they're considering or opening up for public debate. This has already happened. https://t.co/q7IKr5WMLN
— Caitlin Johnstone (@caitoz) August 3, 2019
In 2011 then-Congressman Ron Paul told Politico that “the Patriot Act was written many, many years before 9/11,” adding that the attacks simply provided “an opportunity for some people to do what they wanted to do.” Paul was serving in Congress when the Patriot Act was passed. The Act has since been used to erode human rights at home and abroad by destroying Fourth Amendment protections and legalizing Orwellian surveillance, and it’s safe to assume that the opaque and unaccountable government agencies who were greatly empowered by it had already wanted this to happen.
I have no easy answers for America’s mass shooting epidemic, and as an Australian I see the gun control debate as outside my sovereign territory. I will simply suggest, as I so often do, that if Americans really want to address the problem then the best place to start is to do the first ever honest and in-depth study on the effects of domestic propaganda on the American mind, particularly war propaganda. There are only so many times a certain type of mind can be told violence-glorifying lies before it snaps; if anyone researches mass shootings in the light of the constant psychological abuse that Americans suffer at the hands of their mass media, I guarantee they’ll find a connection. Americans are the most propagandized people on earth because of their proximity to the most strategically crucial part of the empire; it’s not a coincidence that they’re also by far the most prone to mass shootings.
One thing I can tell you won’t fix your problems, America, and that’s listening to the propagandists who want you to hand over even more control to a government that has already begun floating high-altitude surveillance balloons over your country without your permission.
Don’t let them bully you with fear.
___________________
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93 responses to “Americans Should Be Very Skeptical Of Calls For New “Terrorism” Laws”
ALL ‘terrorism’ laws should be treated suspect. We already have laws against assault, menacing, battery, murder, etc. Just like ‘hate crime’ laws, it is nothing more than a tool to punish ‘unacceptable’ views.
Thanks for sharing this information. This is really useful. Keep doing more.
Hmmm
Anyone and everyone demanding more “gun laws” are preaching sedition and in some cases treason depending upon whom they are ultimately arguing these “gun laws” for.
The only way to limit the right to bear arms that does not constitute sedition is by way of a Constitutional Amendment which changes the Second Amendment.
“A well regulated militia, being necessary to the security of a free state, the right of the people to keep and bear arms, SHALL NOT BE INFRINGED.”
Every single gun law ever passed violates this amendment because it the founding fathers in their infinite wisdom did not trust the government and therefore specifically and directly denied the government the power to impose any limitations, exceptions or exemptions……The treasonous swine in Washington not withstanding. “Gun laws”, like “free speech zones”, and “enemy combatants” and “warrant-less searches” are nothing more than means to an end of freedom: yours and mine……
In the final analysis history has taught us time and time again that the only defense against an out of control, tyrannical central government is armed resistance. A fact that was not lost on our Founding fathers as evidenced by their inclusion of the 2nd Amendment. Now you don’t suppose that is why the very same government that is systematically taking away our freedom of speech, assembly, right to petition, protection from warrant-less searches, due process, equal treatment under the law etc. are trying so hard to take away our guns?
Quite frankly, I am truly amazed at just how gullible, ignorant and stupid the entire anti-gun crowd really is by their refusal to look at the bigger picture by refusing to accept the fact that in reality they are not serving America at all, rather those that have taken control of the country and by extension all of us.
The Constitution is not a holy book. It was fine for its time but is far outdated now. But even here it gives a clue: gun ownership is to be protected for a well-regulated militia.” We don’t have one of those, and aren’t likely to get one in a disintegrating country. I know your guns make you feel safe but if the Feds come for you, you’re toast.
The Constitution is a holy book, as far as our form of government and its powers are concerned. There is no other source of authority. Until it is properly amended and ratified to say something else, it is the equivalent of holy writ. Deal with it.
Maybe you can read into the Second Amendment that a good reason for Americans to be armed is for the purpose of having well-regulated militias (the meaning of ‘regulate’ in this context is not what you might think), but it can’t be read as a qualification, i.e., if you are not a member of a militia, then you don’t have the right. Both Heller and McDonald squash that interpretation. It is an individual right, not dependent on membership in a militia.
The Second Amendment does not create a right; the right was already in existence, pre-Constitution, pre-Bill of Rights. The Constitution nowhere grants the Federal government any authority to interfere with the preexisting right, and the Second Amendment was a further clarification or restriction on Federal action.
Don’t believe me? Check out the Cruikshank decision, which has never been overturned or modified in any way. The decision said, in part, that the right to keep and bear arms predates the Bill of Rights or the Constitution, and is not dependent on those instruments for its existence.
Somehow, this idea never gets through the heads of those who want to deny that the right to self defense predates the Constitution, indeed, predates and supersedes any Constitution or government. They want to deny what the language of both the Constitution and the Bill of Rights plainly says, and doesn’t say, along with all of the promoters and early commentators on the amendment. The right is simply beyond the reach of any legitimate government. Period.
You know what is really sad Caitlin? You’re attracting the connedspiracy nutters to your site (read the comments). I actually thought you were better then that, but I see now that this is another part of the problem.
Hmmm
Actually, one problem here, like so many other forums are the startling number of arrogant, ignorant, pretentious, deluded, self-righteous, self entitled drones that can’t tell the difference between government and media propaganda and truth. Truth which more often than not is sitting in plain sight. Truth which they cannot see, let alone understand, because the idea of questioning authority, let alone independently applying critical thinking, rational thought and plain old common sense to the facts in hand is incomprehensible to them.
Common sense gun laws are not “fear mongering” or even against American interests. Nor do they “give more control to the government” as supposed. If THAT were true – explain. But don’t bother to engage in the rhetoric of the gun rights community and their fear of government, most of these arguments are factually baseless.
What common sense gun laws would do is to give Americans more control over their own safety, full stop.
Caitlin, sometimes I definitely do not agree with you, and this yet another one of those times. I am a gun dealer, have been for decades. Our government is inept and unable to reign in the violence, it has to stop.
I’m definitely NOT for giving them “more control”, but that isn’t what common sense gun laws would do anyway. They would not affect our voting process, our judiciary, our legislative or the executive, but they would affect what Americans are doing to each other. Government would not be “more powerful” with common sense gun laws either. In fact, nothing would actually change in regards to what “power” the government already has.
You’ve conflated the issue (again) into something that it isn’t.
The “common sense gun laws” phrase is pure propaganda. The people who oppose universal background checks don’t necessarily oppose the desire to screen people before they buy guns. What they are primarily opposed to is the fact that a background check becomes de facto gun registration. Gun registration does not prevent crime. To the contrary, gun registration lists have been regularly used by authoritarian governments to identify the possible “problematic” citizens so that they can be disarmed (and often jailed or killed), diminishing the ability of the populace to rise up against a tyrannical government. The government would, in fact, become more powerful if people had to register their weapons.
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You might also want to read up on violent crime patterns in countries that have banned or restricted gun ownership. In most cases, violent crime rates went upafter the bans were passed.
……………………
https://crimeresearch.org/2016/04/murder-and-homicide-rates-before-and-after-gun-bans/
By your “logic”, there is no such thing as a common sense gun law. Interesting (and factually false). The rest of your fear-mongering is on you. I am intimately familiar with the claims and fears of the gun crowd. This is an old, tired, worn-out argument. We can’t have common sense gun laws because that would mean “registration” and therefore, we can’t do anything about these weapons in the hands of murderers.
It’s a stupid, ill-conceived argument. It’s akin to saying “dead children are not as important as our gun ownership”. And this is probably how you feel.
The government “does not become more powerful” because of gun registration. That’s a utterly false notion. The people become more powerful by forcing their government to respond to escalating gun violence. The government doesn’t gain any power at all.
You’re also saying that your fears for government takeover in the future outweigh the reality of daily slaughter in our streets. THAT’S TRULY STUPID. Just how many children must die before you admit that there is a serious problem? 50? 100? 200? There are THOUSANDS that have died now and you’re kind is still posing the same bullshit arguments about your own “fears”. It’s utter crap – and shows what cowards you people truly are.
IF the tyranny you fear comes to pass – deal with it then, but pretending it’s the real excuse for refusing to deal with gun violence happening right now is utterly, staggeringly STUPID.
Your kind has already armed themselves to the teeth, there are 500,000,000 (not 300) million guns in this country, we are AWASH in them, and millions are semi-automatic assault rifles now. The odds of being shot in America by an unhinged idiot grow by the day. Stop hiding behind your future fears and deal with reality – the gun lobby is the problem in this country and they have refused to address this issue, bring this all on themselves. Common sense laws, ownership, registration, training, licensing, storage are WAY overdue. And this is coming from a gun DEALER. I’M SICK OF THE CARNAGE and you should be too, but you don’t even mention it. IT’S TIME TO END IT.
It’s clear from your posts that you are either a paid troll, or an easily brainwashed, though possibly well-intentioned person, who has never spent any time studying the subject(s) about which you like to argue.
When you’re ready to come to the table with facts instead of the propagandist’s talking points and ad hominem attacks, let me know. I’m always interested in engaging in **informed** debates, but people like yourself make that impossible. You desperately need to study the facts (actual facts, not establishment talking points), because they do not align with what you are saying. You also need to do a deep dive into history in order to gain a better understanding of reality…yes, it can happen here.
Hold the Teddy Bears and Candles by James Howard Kunster:
https://kunstler.com/clusterfuck-nation/hold-the-teddy-bears-and-candles/
I my opinion this too, is well worth reading.
Mainstream establishment political parties are filled with people who are in the know about what happened 18 years ago on 9/11.
So they try to protect themselves from truthtellers by enacting laws and directives.
People should stop voting for mainstream political parties and vote for independent candidates without any affiliation to known political parties or… do not vote at all. It is that simple.
We really are in the last days. Prophecies are telling us the return of Jesus is very near and I pray the Rosary to hasten His glorious return because I am completely fed up and I have seen more that enough of all the bullshit, of all the careerists and liars of all kinds.
do people still need to continue analyzing and criticizing the zionist press’ lies, spins, coverups, blackouts, censorship, bias, collusion, cowardice, etc etc etc etc??????
why???? to show how much more some professionals can spin yarns and turn clever phrases than amateurs? wasting time and energy that can be channeled into building alternatives?
qui bono?????
we certainly know way more than enough to engage the current NWO expecting change for justice and peace.
BDS! is not the best way but the only way to slay that devil.
and build alternatives around you at the same time.
Whenever there is a terrorist atrocity like the ones in El Paso and Gayton, the US capitalist class and its State machine always exploits the press and media-generated hysteria over such incidents to launch yet more repressive, authoritarian measures.
This illustrates the fundamentally reactionary nature and role of “terrorism” as a political instrument. Throughout history, it has always played into the hands of the corrupt capitalist elite and its State henchmen and women. That is why there is a lot more than meets the eye to a lot of these so-called “terrorist” incidents. State agents provocateurs are undoubtedly involved in a lot of them.
The prevalence of such “mass shootings” in the USA is a graphic manifestation of the profound sickness and psychopathy of that society. When you marry widespread mental illness with freely available guns of all kinds, together with a mass media and film industry that glorifies violence and blood-letting and those who perpetrate it (Rambo et al), then you are BOUND to get mass murders of this type.
Nothing short of a Socialist Revolution, that will remake society from top to bottom, will bring an end to the inherent instability, violence, psychopathy, and anti-social behaviour spawned by a capitalist system in its death throes.
Little wonder American youths are growing up mentally ill when their Government has been waging bloody wars in the Middle East, and elsewhere, for the past 25 years. The utterly bogus “war on terror” has been used as a cover for the increased militarisation, regimentation, and surveillance of American society by an completely unaccountable State apparatus.
The ever-increasing powers being accreted by this unaccountable State apparatus – FBI, CIA, Police, Pentagon – are aimed not at “terrorists” but at the American, and world, working class should it move en masse to challenge the unfettered rule of Capital, and the capitalists, anywhere in the world, but especially, of course, within the American citadel, and its Latin American backyard. Hence the 60 year long covert war to unseat the Cuban regime, and, latterly, a similar campaign of destabilisation against the Venezuelan regime.
If left to their own devices, Trump and his diseased section of the American ruling class will eventually resort to turning the entire country into the kind of concentration camp that now besmirches the US/Mexican border.
The world and American working class should remember well it is only the American capitalist class that has dropped atom bombs on hundreds of thousands of innocent Japanese civilians in 1945 at Hiroshima and Nagasaki.
They have also been behind most of the bloodbaths and genocidal massacres that have followed since 1945 – Korea, Vietnam, the Congo, Palestine, the Balkans, Sudan, Yemen, and the rest.
This class has clearly demonstrated it will stop at NOTHING to preserve its obscene wealth, power, and privileges.
Only a disciplined Revolutionary Socialist Party built on the model of the Bolsheviks of Lenin and Trotsky can topple this class and its murder machine, just as the Bolsheviks toppled Czarism and Russian capitalism in 1917.
Very well stated. May I copy your commentary for my personal private reminder — as I navigate in life? — Your perspective is very grounded.
Thank you Bernadette. I am happy for you to use me as a “reminder” and a “navigator.” But better still you should study the Russian Revolution starting with Trotsky’s “History of the Russian Revolution” which is unrivalled and the benchmark for a proper appreciation of what happened and why. Fond regards.
I would classify this, and many recent shootings, as terrorist events. The question is, for what purpose are these events happening? There is always a political motive for terrorist acts.
The political motive, it seems to me, is to plow the ground even more for gun control/gun confiscation. The actions of the shooters would be terribly misguided if the purpose was to get people to agree with whatever nonsense they were pushing. To call this kind of act counterproductive would be a gross understatement.
Therefore, since the ostensible reasons for the acts will not accomplish their purposes, it is logical to look for another motive. I believe that motive is, and has been for quite some time, more gun control/confiscations. Whether the mechanism be more stringent background checks, red flag laws, bans on certain classes of weapons, waiting periods, or whatever, the motive is clear to me. We are slowly being subjected to mental and emotional shock and awe, meant to soften us up and sap our resolve. Even Trump is spouting gun-control mantras now.
Keep your powder dry, folks.
utter bullshit – you’re claiming that these random acts are somehow connected to a nefarious ‘plot’ with political motives. That is, they were perpetrated to deliberately create a political justification for more gun control.
That is utterly stupid. There is zero evidence of this. All of the 3 recent events in the past week were unconnected from each other, just opportunists to engage in murderous acts. What their reasons were – and what you allege is a political motive (conspiracy) are not the same things. You’ve conflated the issue to your own ignorance and bias.
Moreover, you compound your ignorance with claiming the motive is for more gun control – that is, the shooters motive was to create more gun control. That is worse then absurd – it shows just how stupid you really are. Again, there is no evidence of this AT ALL.
The only time THAT happened was in the Las Vegas massacre, the shooter had left evidence found that indicated he was going to prove just how easy it was to perform his act because America had such lax gun laws. Not many people know this fact, but he is the only one that could be ascribed to a claim such as yours.
It is YOUR ‘motive’ that you seek to validate – your warped notion that there MUST be a political motive behind all of this, versus just the actual, and factual reasons already known. It was hatred and had NOTHING to do with gun control / confiscation.
You, like so many of your ilk, cannot examine evidence or facts and prefer to spin the storyline to suit your bias and fears. As for you ‘powder dry’ bravado bullshit, that’s another demonstration of a keyboard kommando engaging in useless fkn’ fantasy. You’re going to wind in jail or dead if you take that route. You need to wake the fk’ up.
You know, I was going to write a reply. Instead, I’ll just say, “Shut up! You’re not proving you’re any smarter than the rest of us by your responses.”
Why don’t you wake the fk’ up?
Screw you. You’re ignorance is appalling (and very evident). You’ve imagined what wasn’t there, fabricating it whole cloth to suit your own fancy and fears. This is the actions of a fool, an idiot extraordinaire who revels is lies and deceptions. I spent YEARS with your kind, performing shortwave broadcasts shows, listening to the rabid rantings and idiotic conjecture and ridiculous straw arguments and claims – NONE which proved to be factual. This is why your screed and stupidity is being called out – you’re seeking attention to connedspiracy bullshit. You’ve obviously got your own agenda and cannot accept or even identify reality anymore. You’re a sad, pathetic, ignorant creature that is the one that should shut the fuck up, because you are engaging in rabid falsehoods, and they are not harmless at all. It’s your kind of stupid nonsense that has led to violence in this country and that’s why you need to learn the actual facts before spewing utter garbage and propagating fabricated lies. People get hurt by people like you spreading trash – own up to it.
Right back at ya, pal. You are not giving any evidence for your statements. You are just spouting off.
I shouldn’t have even given you the courtesy of my first reply. I don’t normally respond in kind, but you are beyond stubborn…and very vulgar, to boot.
Have a nice life, sir.
Terrorism laws, hate speech laws, and conspiracy theory laws — all of these are just disguised ways for our criminal leaders to protect themselves from prosecution and justice. They are not making these laws for our benefit, but for their benefit! They don’t want us “terrorizing” them, “hating” them, or learning the truth about them.
Good post Paula Densnow.
After a lot of study I’ve become utterly skeptical about mass shootings.
Here’s a possible evaluation checklist :
– was the identified shooter a younger white male, loony, alt right, lonely loser type ? Check
– was he very quickly identified by the media, complete with bio, and m/o. Like really quickly ? Check.
– where there eye-witness reports of multiple shooters, dressed in black, who quickly left the scene and are quickly dismissed as not being part of the official investigation ? Check.
– was there a para-military or govt agency drill going on in that area at that very time ? Check.
– did the media footage of the event ONLY show some people running to and fro, and was the coverage repeated endlessly ? Check.
– was all cctv footage in the area confiscated, never to see the light of day. Check.
In the aftermath expect the mainstream media to quickly move on without asking ANY penetrating questions of the hastily concocted official narrative, and without releasing any intel on the victims.
But of course the ‘event’ enters the growing list of reasons why freedom should be curtailed.
That’s what it was ‘designed’ to do.
This is connedspiracy bullshit, originally posted by that quack Mike Adams (and others).
NONE of these ‘claims’ are relevant. All are either outright lies, easily explained and red herrings.
a) identification happened because ALL the shooters were caught (duh).
b) eye-witness reports of multiple shooters is common in nearly all cases. It is a well-known phenomena (different views from different witnesses). We can be certain that all shooters were actually caught and identified (let law enforcement do it’s job – they are the experts, not you couch potato idiots).
c) the para-military training claim a red herring. Doesn’t mean squat, even if true. Happens all the time, all over the place.
d) media footage is “what they had” at the time they had it. Also doesn’t mean anything. Are you stupidly suggesting that a camera crew should have been on standby to film the entire thing? You’re an idiot.
e) CCTV footage is always confiscated, it’s part of the evidence in a crime scene. Also, very normal, doesn’t “mean” what you think, not even close.
f) jesus this one is dumb – the media reported what they knew AT THE TIME. And they’ve released a lot more NOW THAT THEY KNOW. It doesn’t change the “official narrative” it IS the official narrative.
God I’m sick of you morons and idiots always fabricating stupid connedspiracies. You’re not even very good at it. You’re “logic” is absent, your evidence doesn’t exist and you see fear, lies in everything.
It’s idiots like YOU that are ‘designed’ to spread falsehood, rumors, innuendo’s and conspiracy. You’ve got your own agenda and are seeking to capitalize on tragedy. That’s pretty fkn’ sick. You’re disgusting.
There’s no need to express your view with that level of profanity. Questioning official narratives is entirely reasonable given the level of deception utilised across a whole range of significant events for decades. Unfortunately there are definitely conspiracies which have been discovered by careful and diligent research, and your fuming cannot change that. You will note that I refrain from conclusions in this case but simply ask questions. These questions come from discovering that there’s a pattern to many similar events. However they are certainly complex situations, and it’s almost impossible to judge the full truth of what we’re told, from a distance. You do make some reasonable points but there’s no need to taint the discussion with such obvious fury. I’m skeptical of official narratives for the very good reason that they are so often proven lamentably wrong, and as I say, deceptive. Is this deception deliberate ? Sometimes it is, and has been proven to be so.
Your tone is better than Passing By’s, but his/her reasoning is better.
Thanks DH. I prefer not to give a long dissertation of my views on this subject. Suffice to say I agree with most of what JM posts here. When you look hard into many of these shooting events there is invariably a disconnect between the facts as they can be discovered, and the official narrative. That does not mean some people didn’t die. But as to the real perpetrators and their motives, that’s very often a deep dark rabbit hole covered over by fake news. Going down that rabbit hole takes some effort , nerve and vigilance. Blind acceptance of what we’re told does not serve us well, never has, never will.
Good stuff, but you stop short by not connecting the dots between those who wrote the Patriot Act years before it was enacted, those who signed the Project for the New American Century’s Rebuilding America’s Defenses, which called for a catalyzing event, such as “a new Pearl Harbor,” those who coordinated the 9-11 false flag, and those who direct Americans’ daily diet of guns and violence. Also, your cop out, as an Australian, is bogus, because this agenda has already been implemented in your homeland, following a tightening of gun laws:. https://www.wsws.org/en/articles/2017/10/06/terr-o06.html
The cops and the spies always have their wish lists. They are always pushing for more, so they already know what they want. An event like 9-11 is more like them getting to push through their wish lists plus a few ideas on their wildest dreams list. But in itself that doesn’t mean there is a conspiracy. Every group has at least some ideas as to what they’d do if suddenly they had more power. The police, the spies and the military all the more so because they have federal money and billionaires funding their think tanks that make their plans.
I’d guess someone at the Rand Corp answered the phone and had to immediately ask the caller which blueprint they wanted shipped to them? Did they want the most recent plan? Or any of the other plans which had been drawn up every 3 years since old FDR finally died and got out of the way? Please be aware sir that if you want plans older than that we’ll need an extra day to get it to you because we have to access the J. Edgar Hoover archive to access the pre-WW2 plans, and they are stored off-site. 🙂
Meanwhile, in the Good News of the day….. American oligarchs just lost billions because of Trump the Loose Cannon and his tweets. Trump overruled his advisors and slapped threatened sanctions on China, despite the renewal of talks. On Monday in Gotham City, the Dow Jones industrial average fell by 760 pts. Another headline said that Big Tech had lost $162 Billion in value in the crashing market.
So, since I think these are the same oligarchs who really run things in America behind its farcical facade of democracy, how long do you think these powerful and insanely rich people are going to put up with a loose cannon like Trump costing them billions or even trillions of dollars? Its interesting that all of the Financial Press seems to be united against Trump. Well, all that is except for the meddling by foreigners like the evil Australians who regularly meddle in American politics! Please note that I am referring to Rupert Murdoch who owns formerly respected Wall Street Journal and Fox News and other outlets, and not the wonderful miss Caitlin. 🙂
i believe NOTHING the zionist press spews.
i take the opposite of their “report” true.
what they ignore is most important, and
what they scream over and over and over has no real basis.
At least 72 shot, 13 killed in Chicago alone (last weekend). Where’s the national outcry? Note: Chicago has some of the most restrictive gun laws in the nation (they don’t work). This kind of activity goes on every weekend in many major US cities but apparently we don’t hear about it or we’ve become numb to hearing it and/or it doesn’t fit the MSM narrative as being worthy of national attention. What this proves is that even the best laws do not work if they are not enforced. Recent history might also suggest that existing laws are enforced quite selectively.
Restrictive gun laws mean nothing when all one has to do is to drive to the next county. Even going to the solid Republican state of Indiana (VP Pence used to be its Governor) is just a trip to the suburbs. Gary, Indiana is just a suburb of Chicago.
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And as to why no one notices, well, lets check a website. A check of ABC news does not find the word Chicago in any headline anywhere on its main page. 0 words found. What shootings?
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Yes, people can go and find out. I am not some crazy conspiracy nut trying to say the shootings in Chicago didn’t occur! I’ve lived in a big American city and heard the regular gunfire outside my window. Chicago seems to taken to an even higher level, but when you’ve spent nights wondereing if the brick wall was enough of if you should go crouch in the tub, then the story sounds plausible. But, most people don’t pay a lot of attention to the news. They are more concerned with working their three jobs and trying to teach their children important stuff that the teachers ignore and trying to pay the past-due bills before the repo man arrives. So, if the big media isn’t pushing the story, many won’t even know.
Maybe we should do a reader poll?
Have you ever heard gunfire outside your home?
Have you ever crawled to the bathtub making sure to stay down low where the brick walls would give you some cover?
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I don’t really do emoticons, but if there’s one for raising one’s hand, my personal answers are to say yes to both. Welcome to America.
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Which leads to “Gun Control is complicated”. I’ve lived in urban areas, and I can understand that many would feel that there’s just too damned many guns around. I’ve also lived so far out in the country that carrying a gun for encounters with dangerous wildlife is simply prudence, so I can understand why people outside the cities object to anyone trying to take their guns.
People who were willing to work together could solve this, but this combination is in a country where people are by now trained by the screamers in mass and social media to be completely unable to even talk with someone who disagrees with them. In a country where politics is all about expressing hatred for the other side, and where much of that is well earned since they are all monsters. In a country with lots and lots of guns around, and which is the world leader in nuclear weapons. What could go wrong?
“Restrictive gun laws mean nothing when all one has to do is to drive to the next county.”
Substitute the word “drugs” instead of “guns” and what one can realize is that given the market demand there will always be a supply available whether any such contraband item is legal or not. Did nation-wide prohibition laws stop the sale of alcohol? No, it simply made those willing to break the law very wealthy, often with a side of public violence and perhaps with the corruption of the supposed law enforcers. Can one suspect that today’s illegal drug trade involving many billions of dollars might have something to do with the outrageous violence we witness? Very simple then, we going to take the dope dealers guns away by simply passing another ineffective law that covers the entire United States? Has that worked yet for the illegal drugs they sell when millions of fools are lined up to buy their product with cash in hand? No, the dope dealers will simply get more and better guns, probably military grade full automatic weapons from the same suppliers they currently get their truckloads of drugs from and maybe they’ll even start selling those weapons also, all under the strictly cash black market. There’s plenty of money in that business for a little extra hardware deemed necessary to the business, any time. So some caring people suggest we simply cast aside the Second Amendment of the United States Constitution, the right to keep and bear arms as reserved to The People, and then The People will simply follow the law as all good people do and thus agree to be forever defenseless against those other people who do not choose to follow the law. Perfect!
As usual, witnesses report multiple shooters. In El Paso, witnesses saw four men dressed in black, walking together through the store, shooting indiscriminately. This will disappear down the Memory Hole, just like in every other case, including Las Vegas, where witnesses reported shooters on the ground.
Anyway, this isn’t about gun grabbing. We now have our Patriot Act rolled out.
What Russiagate left out, Trump will push through, using the uproar created by the murders to further increase internet censorship.
And, to use ”pre-crime” prediction tools (yeah, that should work well) and involuntary imprisonment for Hate Crimes.
The Patriot Act has got nothing on today’s repression.
In response to the recent mass shootings, Trump discussed the necessity of censoring “hate speech” on social media, developing tools & laws to identify pre-crime, enforcing mental health treatment including involuntary confinement, and expediting the death penalty for “hate crimes”.
The interesting thing is that it is impossible to know either way. I watch Hoffman and DeNiro in “Wag the Dog” every so often just to remind myself. Old Shoe and the Fighting 403! You can’t tell, without inside knowledge, which is true, and its really highly likely that both the official and alternative versions are all just propaganda. Do you think they wouldn’t go that far? Or maybe they’ll spin out so many competing alternate versions to get everyone arguing about which is true, like they did when the blew John Kennedy’s brains into his pretty wife’s lap. Just saying about all you can do is to ignore the whole spectacle and ask Cui Bono? And remember to only trust that which you see yourself, which can be quite revealing if you go out and look around a bit. Going to protests, both pro and con, can be revealing in itself.
(Sorry Paula, not trying to preach at you, but instead just give general advice. One thing about getting old is that while you think maybe you’ve figured out a little bit, you see a younger world behind you and you know that if they don’t know what you might have figured out then they are probably in for a world of hurt! That’s what makes us old folks so bothersome!)
A good time to give my favorite political model. The whole 1-D, Left to Right model is garbage. It creates a fake impression that the biggest enemy of the right end of the line is the left end of the line. Instead, I prefer a 3-D shape. More likely to model the real world. A Cone, to be precise. The Oligarchs who run things are up at the tip of the cone. What is commonly called Left and Right are just different spots on the circle that is the base of the cone.
I know this, because I’ve gone back and forth between far left and far right and found that while they differ, they also have a lot in common. I’m the guy who could show up to protest Obama because of his raids on marijuana dispensaries, and then wander across the parking lot to the Tea Party brigade and have some good conversations on the stuff we agreed about. When you learn to translate that when they complain about Liberals they are complaining about the same people you call The Establishment, you can have some interesting conversations. When the conversation becomes how the Oligarchs are shafting us all, it can go in more useful directions. 🙂
Already posted a reply to this sort of utter nonsense, but will past it here again:
This is connedspiracy bullshit, originally posted by that quack Mike Adams (and others).
NONE of these ‘claims’ are relevant. All are either outright lies, easily explained and red herrings.
a) identification happened because ALL the shooters were caught (duh).
b) eye-witness reports of multiple shooters is common in nearly all cases. It is a well-known phenomena (different views from different witnesses). We can be certain that all shooters were actually caught and identified (let law enforcement do it’s job – they are the experts, not you couch potato idiots).
c) the para-military training claim a red herring. Doesn’t mean squat, even if true. Happens all the time, all over the place.
d) media footage is “what they had” at the time they had it. Also doesn’t mean anything. Are you stupidly suggesting that a camera crew should have been on standby to film the entire thing? You’re an idiot.
e) CCTV footage is always confiscated, it’s part of the evidence in a crime scene. Also, very normal, doesn’t “mean” what you think, not even close.
f) jesus this one is dumb – the media reported what they knew AT THE TIME. And they’ve released a lot more NOW THAT THEY KNOW. It doesn’t change the “official narrative” it IS the official narrative.
God I’m sick of you morons and idiots always fabricating stupid connedspiracies. You’re not even very good at it. You’re “logic” is absent, your evidence doesn’t exist and you see fear, lies in everything.
It’s idiots like YOU that are ‘designed’ to spread falsehood, rumors, innuendo’s and conspiracy. You’ve got your own agenda and are seeking to capitalize on tragedy. That’s pretty fkn’ sick. You’re disgusting.
fearmongering is the best tool for the blood-sucking ghouls aka 1% to keep the 99% in check.
Some of these mass shootings are suspicious. Many of these shooters have had contact with the FBI shortly before committing their crimes (Las Vegas, Parkland, Ft. Lauderdale airport shooting, etc.), and many of these people were known to have metal/emotional issues — they were perfect patsies. There have been many reports of multiple shooters at these incidents, and problems with timelines and official narratives that don’t align with witness testimony.
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What they want more than anything right now is to disarm the populace. Anything that drives that narrative is suspect. I can’t help but wonder if we’re not seeing the effects of MK–Ultra. For those who don’t know about it, here’s a bit of what they were doing:
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Quote:
“A disturbing 1954 document details an experiment during which two women were hypnotized and one was made to try to wake the other. When the first woman didn’t stir, the other woman was ordered to “fly into a rage and shoot her.” The entranced woman picked up an (intentionally unloaded) pistol, pointed it at the other woman and pulled the trigger before falling into a “deep sleep.” Upon waking, neither woman remembered anything about the sequence.
Another time, a hypnotized woman was told to wait by a phone to receive a call. The person on the other end would mention a code word in the course of a normal conversation, causing the woman to pass into an undetectable trance state. The woman would then proceed to a location and plant an incendiary device hidden in a briefcase.”
https://nypost.com/2016/07/23/the-dark-cia-experiments-that-inspired-jason-bourne-movies/
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The blank stares of these shooters and the hypnotic, trance-like state that many of them seem to be in when they commit their acts should give us all pause. Something is not right with these stories, and the fact that there is an army of deep state actors who quickly push the narrative of needing new laws, regulations, and policies to further diminish the rights of law abiding citizens should cause any reasonable person to question what’s really going on and why.
Thanks, I concur. Something is going on and it isn’t as cut and dried as young men suddenly going nuts.
One thing to keep in mind about American gun control debates. Everything in American politics is highly partisan. Team Red feels they must beat Team Blue at all costs, and vice versa. Thus each always looks for any tiny advantage to be gained on the other Team. The gun manufacturers strongly tilt their support to Team Red. Thus, Team Blue sees an advantage is lessening the wealth and power of the gun manufacturers. Cutting gun sales is something that Team Blue feels will lead to Team Red having less money in a political system designed such that who has the most money wins. There can be more to it than that, of course. Nothing is a simple Twitter msg. The same can be seen when it comes to unions. Unions have traditionally supported Team Blue, so Team Red feels they can gain an advantage over Team Blue by weakening unions. It is always key to remember that especially for the professional politicians in the Teams, winning is everything and they always look to gain an advantage whenever they can. Being politicians, they of course try to cover this with emotional arguments to convince at least their fellow Team members to support the move. Those arguments are aimed at the portion of the Team that are not professional politicians, but which like Sports Fans like to think of themselves as a part of the Team and refer frequently to the Team as We.
What I fail to understand is why people choose not to believe some things the media tell them but to believe others. Why necessarily believe that the reporting of a mass shooting must mean it happened? Why not scrutinise this alleged pretty improbable-sounding event and check for any anomalies before accepting it as true? Does anyone not see any anomalies at all in the various versions of the story and eyewitness testimonies?
There is the well-known phenomenon of false flag and the much lesser known but I think much more prevalent phenomenon of false-flag hoax. What says that the mass shootings are not either of these types of events?
Pay my travel expenses and I’ll meet you at the El Paso city morgue.
I’ve worked out many lies by the media without lifting my bottom from my chair.
Have you scrutinised the media stories? Is there anything you don’t believe from the media and why do you not believe the things you don’t believe and why do you believe these media stories?
I’ve worked out many lies from the media without lifting my bottom from my chair.
Have you scrutinised the media stories?
Is there anything you don’t believe from the media and why do you not believe those things?
What makes you believe these media stories?
At my taiji class Sunday, there was a brief discussion of the recent mass killings. The teacher (who usually doesn’t comment on politics) said, ‘Afghanistan. Home to roost.’ Later: ‘Guns, guns, guns. War, war, war. What do you think happens next?’
And consider all the pro-war propaganda aimed at Americans. American media regularly portrays violence as the solution to problems. In fact, it regularly says that violence is the only solution. How often has it been broadcast to Americans that “violence is the only thing they understand?” That is a regular and constant message out of Hollywood to Americans. And the supposedly smart talking heads on everything from MSNBC to CNN to FOX regularly repeat the same message. Many political campaigns rely on calling the opponent “Weak” and “Cowardly”. The people who exert violence on behalf of the state, the military, the spies, and the police, are regularly presented as “Heroes”. And pretty much every such drama routinely has scenes where the violence is justified to the audience. Not only justified, but presented as absolutely necessary. While the primary goals of such messages are to build support for high taxes and to aid military recruitment, it seems rather obvious that teaching an entire society that violence is the only solution will have more far-reaching effects.
“The first draft of the massive USA Patriot Act was introduced a week after the 9/11 attacks…”
and by the very people who were behind this sad event of 9/11 and everybody knows it but are playing their role of “believers” in the goodness of the political, financial and media elite of the Western nations.
It proves we are living in the return of the days of Noah just before the Second Coming of Jesus, which return is very very near according to many prophecies, especially the prophecy of the popes which is telling us that pope Francis is the last pope and that he will witness the return of Jesus and the Final Judgement of mankind.
As it was in the days of Noah when Noah was the only man of good faith, there are no more men of good faith in our days; almost everyone is of bad faith.
I am totally fed up. I have really but really seen enough bullshit. And I pray the Rosary to hasten the Glorious return of Jesus, which return could be any day now.
Te FBI wants “Conspiracy Theorists” (CIA term introduced in 964 to tr those who disbelieved the Warren Commission Report) to be labeled “domestic terrorists”. It’s the term of the day. Things are about to get very tight. There is a lot of tension, everywhere in the US, even among the elites who see that the next financial crisis will have to be the reset. Not all of the elites see that. The ones that do got bunkers. Stay in place and grow vegetables. Contribute to your family and community. Ride a bike. I’ve got nothing fancy for you. http://www.johndayblog.com/
The Americans who can really hear your message Caitlin, are to few and powerless to stop the juggernaut of government oppression that is rolling over all of us. We still don’t have the charismatic leader and mass movement that might be adequate to do the job of real government reform – and the time is getting very late to save ourselves……
Resistance is Futile. There is no alternative. That is of course the most important message that they want everyone to believe.
amen. BDS everyone and everything associated with the evil!
Some years back Democracy Now ran a segment with a former FBI agent stating that a large contingent in the FBI plan terrorist attacks under the guise of capturing would be individuals (muslims) committing terrorist acts. Sadly, it was the FBI agents creating the plan and supplying fake weapons, recruiting someone, then arresting them. Yet, none of it would have happened if it wasn’t for the FBI plotting. There were two near incidences same day in Santa Monica and Hollywood (gay pride celebrations) where young men (early 20’s) were apprehended with weapons, but nothing was ever reported later. Complete silence on both incidents. It appeared to be a setup while reading the initial report for each incident.
https://www.naturalnews.com/2019-08-04-bombshell-mass-shooting-events-fbi-plots.html
One report among others: https://www.democracynow.org/2015/3/19/how_the_fbi_created_a_terrorist
You may find other references and examples (i.e.) such as Operation Northwood declassified documents.
During the Obama administration it became legal for our government to openly propagandize US citizens. Not that it wasn’t done before but now it is legal to do it.
Just consider a bit more what’s actually going on here. Because the FBI orchestrates these “terrorist incidents” stem to stern, “balls to bones”, the FBI knows with ABSOLUTE CERTAINTY that what the arrested person has done did NOT constitute a REAL threat to US national security. It was, at most, a hypothetical or make-believe “threat”.
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This person who has been entrapped by the FBI is in reality being arrested for what he THINKS he/she is doing! He or she is being arrested for, literally, a “crime” of THOUGHT — AKA “thought crime”!
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Presumably, what the FBI is trying to do is jail people who just MIGHT become terrrrists. In that case, what is most relevant in these entrapments is the extent to which the entrapped person had to be “enticed” to “get with the plan” (made by the FBI).
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(I’m immediately reminded of the old joke about the extremely well-dressed, Rolex-wearing guy who walks up to a stunning beauty on a dance floor and, after a little banter, asks her in all seriousness if she’d have sex with him for $100,000. She thinks about the offer for a while and says “well, I guess so”. Then the guy says “how about for $100?” and she angrily replies “just what do you think I am, anyway?” He then says -“well, your first answer told me what you are. Now I’m just negotiating a fair price.”)
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Can you imagine walking up to some homeless, drunken person downtown and promising to pay that person $100,000 if he throws a pipe bomb at a government building at midnight? What would his/her answer be? Do you arrest him/her the moment after he/she says “yes”, …… or do you bother to wait until he/she throws the fake “bomb”? To our system of “justice”, the difference between the two indicates whether the person was “serious” when he/she/whatever said yes.
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I predict that as time marches on, because of the difficulty and expense of finding out if people are “serious”, arrests and convictions will happen with just a “yes”. Better safe than sorry.
I should make perfectly clear that I’m NOT saying that the recent and past famous mass-shooting incidents were carried out be people entrapped by the FBI, et.
Stephen Paddock didn’t need a motive because he wasn’t the shooter.Try several Saudi helicopters with transponders off and multiple gunmen.Evidence (including post mortem reports) IAMJOHNCULLEN-John E Hoover.
Stephen Paddock didn’t need a motive because he wasn’t the shooter.Try several Saudi helicopters with transponders off and multiple gunmen.Evidence (including post mortem reports) IAMJOHNCULLEN-John E Hoover.
Americans have always been propagandized if for no other reason than the major historical events that have been deleted from the history books we were taught by! (See Conspiracy at Philadelphia, Massacre
at Fort Negro, the Shays’ and the Whiskey Rebellions of 1785 and 1791-94!…………http://garynorth.com/philadelphia.pdf ,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=k3aN6A4Alcw&t=1s, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5xUro2z2tI,https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=diXeswu3Rz0&t=1264s)
But it is more accurate to say that China and Russia take first and second place in that respect and the U.S.
is though distant a considerable third when it comes to brainwashing and propaganda.
TRUTH IS STRANGER THAN HISTORY STILL YET, IS IT NOT?
How many nations have Russia and China destroyed in the last say 30 years, while telling their citizens nothing but lies in support of those invasions/bombings/regime-change color revolutions? How many?
I do love the way that anyone who does not wholeheartedly believe in Truth, Justice and the American Way must by definition be a victim of brainwashing and propaganda.
I can comprehend a person getting so mad at someone that they lose it and want to kill them. I can not comprehend taking a gun into a crowd and killing as many innocent people as possible. That is just very sick. All of these lost lives and shattered families because the United States of America is a very dysfunctional nation. Perhaps if it reaches a mass killing every single day our politicians might take their heads out of the sand.
And do what?
“A society is abnormal if it is full of hate crimes. How can a country be great again if lonely haters are everywhere? The US trouble does not come from outside, but from within.” –Global Times Op-Ed (China)
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It was the first part of that which really struck me when I read it……… “A society is abnormal when it is full of hate crimes.”
If your house is not in order; you have to admit that first. Once you have done that you can honestly look at ” everything ” that is wrong with it. If anyone honestly looks at United States society there are thousands of things that are wrong with it from top to bottom. Mass killings are just going to keep on happening and happening much more often as United States society implodes on itself.
The U.S. Americans are in a state of induced coma – they will obey.
Occasionally, the intense alienation within the U.S. American culture of violence
becomes so great that someone will break out of the induced coma in a fit of rage,
then mentally snap,
and blast away.
No More War
amen. many killers in our criminal wars come back home to roost. karma.
Don’t forget that many of those killers are hired by police departments. If you check their job application pages, you will see that they give preference to hiring “those who’ve served out country” over other applicants. American police kill over a thousand Americans every year. But of course this is treated very, very differently when the killing is done by the boys and girls in blue. When police officers “snap” and open fire, not as trained professionals but by wildly firing until they run out of ammunition, leaving one or more people on the ground with 40 or so bullets in them, that is called heroism.
the zionist warmngering press NEVER count or report on the number of the trained and experienced killers who come back home ready to kill the civilians. all trained by the Israeli thugs. so they must be a lot of them.
the zionist warmongering press NEVER count or report on the number of the trained and experienced killers who come back home ready to kill the civilians. all trained by the Israeli thugs. so there must be a lot of them. why else?
Prior to 9/11, four FBI field offices reported arab/flight school issues, all ordered to stand down. On Aug 16, 2001 FBI agents arrested Zacarias Moussaoui, hijacker #20, ordered not to interrogate. FBI arab translator, Sibel Edmonds warned of hijack attacks, ignored. Five Urban Moving Systems spies were arrested, ordered released by FBI. CIA asset Susan Lindauer warned multiple agencies of hijack attacks from May 2001, convicted of treason, see “Extreme Prejudice” for details. US Army intelligence unit Abel Danger had tracked Atta gang for months, disbanded Jan 2001, ordered to Pentagon on 9/11 and murdered.
DO NOT FEED THE MOUTH THAT BITES YOU.
What bothers me the MOST about this post is that you are giving credence to the ABSURD official story of TWC hijackers and planes being hijacked that day and furthermore it also gives affirmation to the equally absurd Pentagon and Shanksville lies… Please be diligent to not be part of the problem and be part of the solution to disseminating the truth …
Thanks; you read my mind.
Uncle Toms are worse than their masters. they have to prove their loyalty to their masters by abusing the weak and oppressed.
what about the gun-mongers who claim that they have the right to bear arms to guard liberty against the state authority? when was the last time they actually stood up to the power for the liberty of the weak???? they always shoot the weak and unarmed. they are most disgusting bunch of cowards who undermine the very liberty they claim to defend.
Kevin Harris shot and killed a US Marshal at the beginning of the Ruby Ridge Siege. Four ATF agents were killed by the Branch Davidians during the initial assault on Mt. Carmel. There have other killings of police by “Sovereign Citizens” and WN’s.
one exception, whooopdidoo! the opposite cases are too numerous to even count.
Technically, Curri listed two examples. Ruby Ridge and the Branch Davidians were very separate incidents. And there are others that come to mind. The killings of five Dallas LEO’s a couple of years ago is one that comes to mind. (and as a personal note, I am against the killing of any human being, and police officers are human beings no matter how hard they try to deny it)
I did a search, and it looks they actually deserve your admiration!:
https://www.mcclatchydc.com/news/nation-world/national/article196423174.html
Between 2011 and 2017, there were 11 officers killed by right-wing extremist groups compared to those eight officers killed by left-wing groups, according to ADL. That’s a much narrower gap than in the previous two decades: From 2001-2010, right-wing extremists killed 24 officers while those on the left killed two, and from 1991-2000 the figures were 16 and one, respectively.
Joshua Freilich, co-creator of the Department of Homeland Security-funded U.S. Extremist Crime Database, had similar findings on far-right extremists: 45 police officers have been killed by far-right extremists since 1990, with four additional killings still under review. Far-right extremists have killed one officer in 2017, according to his research, while far-left extremists have killed two, with another death still under review. (Freilich’s numbers don’t include the killings of the two corrections officers that were part of the ADL’s tally; while the two Georgia inmates were members of a white supremacist gang, their attacks on the corrections officers came during an escape attempt and were not seen as ideologically motivated, a requirement in Freilich’s calculations.)
Vietnam war ended only when enough number of GIs started shooting their officers and desert the battlefields. not because there were hippies dancing in the streets.
Actually, the Pentagon brass supported Nixon withdrawing the troops from Vietnam, and one of the reasons cited is that they were very afraid of rioting at home and needed the troops closer at hand to deal with it. Like with all things, there is no simple answer to anything, and the break down of morale of the troops in Vietnam was undoubtedly another factor. But I love the way that the one popular movement which has stopped an American war is regularly dismissed and discounted. Everyone please forget that this ever happened because we certainly don’t want anyone to think that they might do it again.
the number of the people who identified themselves as anti-war was 10-15% of the entire population, even at its height.
Boomer grandma here…When LIFE magazine came out with A WEEKS DEAD IN VIETNAM in the format of a high school yearbook my father’s generation cracked. Mine, WWII naval officer in the Pacific and North African landings openly cried in public it moved him so much. It was one of the most effective statements ever put out, and all true…each soldier had his little biography.
McNamara gave the war away when he made the body count official policy…it was genocide and the young soldiers knew it. They are still living with their official murders just as many live with Agent Orange, the defoliant.
ABSOLUTELY CORRECT!
I actually remember the rumors of this… I missed the draft by 4 months…
Fear is a potent weapon when the government does not address the real problems of mental health and easy access to automatic weapons. People are confused, AFRAID and have pretty much thrown their hands up in the air in desperation, despite knowing the right thing to do IS NOT BEING DONE ON PURPOSE BY THEIR GOVERNMENT. They don’t believe they have time to ask “WHY” ??? So they’ll grab at whatever straws the government offers to make them believe they are safer while at the same time putting more and more pieces of their agenda of fear, control and removal of basic First Right Freedoms. It’s a sad sick world we live in and the asylum is being run by the inmates which is most definitely not the people.
Guido, you are SPOT ON my friend. I’m amazed at how the fear freezes people’s ability to think for themselves, followed by panic. Yes, it seems almost everyone is throwing their hands up, especially the Right who are just now realizing they made a huge blunder, but their pride is getting in the way of admitting that mistake.
Thank you for that… it means a great deal to me .
Just like 9/11 MSM and the “Deep State” bureaucrats will use this as an opportunity to curtail more civil rights. If we could give away habeas corpus in the blink of an eye and run Quantanamo as an American gulag after the Twin Towers, just think the mischief these political miscreants will have with specially tailored domestic “terrorism” laws. First it will start out with those killers who are truly murderers and wind up dragging every person who protests the ruling party du jour before a Star Chamber committee for “rehabilitation”. That’s how it always starts. Use the monsters among us to pass laws that will ultimately drag the innocent to the stake for this season’s cultural or political expediency.
Speaking of Guantanimo, how many POTUS candidates have promised to close Gitmo if they are elected? Remember O’bomb’em making that promise?
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While I’m typing, how many have promised to shut down those 800+ overseas military bases?